Dan
 

This is the underpainting for a portrait I am working on.

Oil on Canvas, 24" x 18"

Critiques, comments? Digital demonstration OK.

Reference photo
 

Here is the reference photo.

Underpainting -- later
 

Here is the current state of the underpainting. I am reaching the point where I don't know what to do to improve it.

Hi Chuck,

I think the reason that you're not getting any replies to this post is because we are waiting for somebody who works in this underpainting/glazing technique to jump in. In the meantime, I think you have done a fine job with a good photograph. However, I think you have straighted out the tilt in his head. If you place a ruler under the corner of the eye to our right you'll see that you've brought down the other eye in the drawing for your underpainting.

It strikes me that one of the nice things about the underpainting technique is that you can make this sort of drawing change quite painlessly, before you've added color or (possibly) texture to the surface.

Best wishes,
Linda

Hi Linda,

Thanks for your response. Actually, the whole picture is rotated a little. I took a new vertical for the painting through the line of the doorknob and deadbolt that are in the bacckground of the photo. That said, I could well have gotten the angle of the line of the eyes off; I'll chek it this evening.

After all that, the pose of the photo actually feels more stable to me than that of the underpainting. If I had it all to do over, I would have left the angle alone.

Your narrow range of value is good...except that some of the shadows in the shirt are slightly too dark at this stage.

I cannot see this closeup but be sure that you eliminate texture in an underpainting...that comes in the upper layers.

To clearly define areas of general light and general shadow and to determine composition is the main purpose in an underpainting.

Don't forget to lose some of those edges at this stage - it is a very important part of your composition.

Karin,

Thank you for your suggestions; I'll work on incorporating them tonight. Thanks especially for the reminder to lose edges; I think that, when I am trying to capture a likeness, I have a tendency to forget that I am creating a painting rather than copying a photograph.

Lose edges
 

Dear Chuck,

I posted in another forum about losing edges earlier today. Be sure to let the flesh at the hairline break that hard line of the hair. Also, the left side of the shirt by the arm has a dark line all the way down. The original photo has matching values near the armpit. I think that sometimes because we "know" that "this is the line of the shirt" that we draw it and paint it that way without realizing that the light would never stop dead like that.

I tell my students that the darks that we make are like rivers and that the light on either side of the dark shadows are the "land". Now, how does one get across a river? Either a bridge or stepping stones is the answer. Your photo proves that there are bridges of light (diagonal patterns of light) from the arm to the chest and I know by observing other pictures that I have seen of yours that you would put this in on your finished piece. But I think that it is important to always block these things in perhaps even when doing the underpainting. I think that you have a great start here.

Your paintings are really wonderful and I greatly admire your talent.

The only other thing that I would say is that the eye on the right seems to have a larger orbit than you have painted. Using the clock face as an example, in the photo the eyefold line is going from 3 or 4 o'clock on it's right to about 10 or 11:00 on it's left and you have painted it from 3 or 4 to 9 or thereabouts. Change that line and I think that you will be very happy with the likeness factor. But as I said before, I am very enamoured with your work and I know when this gets finished that it will look like him. You are brave and very very good. :)

I hope to have some pictures up soon for you to critque for me also. :)

Underpainting - even later
 

Hi Celeste,

Thank you for your suggestions and your words of encouragement. I have made changes in the underpainting to include your input.

Here is the underpainting as of today.

Underpainting close-up
 

Here is a close-up view of the head.

Excellent
 

Dear Chuck,
I knew that you would keep improving him until he is perfect. I can't wait to see the finished painting! :)

Again, eliminate the texture on the beard

Celeste,

Thanks so much for cheering me on! Your encouragement helps me to try my best.


Karin,

Thank you again for your advice. As may be obvious, this is my first attempt at underpainting, and your guidance is really helpful in making the concept clear. I have read through the other examples in the forum, but how to transfer that to my particular painting has not always been clear to me.

Oops, I misunderstood what you meant by texture. I thought you meant paint texture rather than the texture of the subject, and I was busily smoothing out my brush strokes!

I will be implementing your advice tonight after I get home. Again, thanks.

Great job!

I really like the expression of the subject, and I think you have captured it very well in your underpainting. I look forward to seeing the final piece!

Mai :)

Goodby texture, hello unity?
 

Here is the latest update of the underpainting.

Mai, thank you for your compliment.

Close-up

Good job on the face Chuck. But it looks to me as if some of that light may be creeping too far into the shadow side of the beard area?

Meanwhile, get rid of the texture in the background and make an interesting pattern of light and shadow that will frame and enhance the face and add to your composition. It will also be easier to find and lose edges with background value chages.

Since we're moving right along, let's take a second look at the shirt. Pardon me if I repeat myself, but this is important...

Lighten the shadows on the left side of the shirt as they fall in the center of light and cannot be that dark. No shadow or dark will appear very dark when surrounded by light.

Also, no light on the dark side will equal the intensity of light on the light side.

Your reference photo is a pack of lies as your shadows appear much too dark. Paint what you know - NOT what you see in this regard.

You're on the right track - keep working!

Simplify, simplify, simplify
 

"Texture!?! We don't got no texture! We don't need no steenking texture!" - Texture of the Sierra Madre

Close-up

On the shirt, you have a vertical line dividing light from shadow, I suggest a more gentle transition here.

Areas of high contrast and sharp focus belong in the area of the center of interest in a painting.

Also, I'd really like to see you establish a pattern of some sort in the background to enhance your composition. Below is a scribble (and I am sure that you can do better)...but I think that it gives the background some "interest."

Karin,

Thanks again. I can't see your latest attachment, but I'll try to come up with something.

Pattern

:thumbsup:

Karin,

Thanks; this is a valuable learning experience for me, and I'm sure it has also helped others who have been following this thread.

Dan
 

I admire your tenacity Chuck.

Jean

With color
 

The painting is still in progress; here is its state as of this morning.

Here is the close-up. The image on screen seems to have higher contrast than it looks like in person.

Hi Chuck,

You did a splendid job with the underpainting, with all your hard work!

I realize that the painting is in progress, and have a few suggestions (I assume you want some feedback, since you post this under the 'Oil Critique' section):

The skintone (as well as the upper half of the painting) look very 'warm' right now.

The colour and value of the background is too close to the colour of the subject face. I would change the (colour or value) background to bring the face to the viewers' attention a bit more. Are you in the process of glazing another colour over the colour of the background?

It also seems like the upper half (background) colour is competing with the colour of his shirt. I would determine a local colour and that would be the 'dominating' colour. Right now, the blue of his shirt and the background colour are competing with each other (not sure if I make myself clear here).

Are you glazing this painting, or painting directly over the underpainting?

The more I look at this painting, the more I like the subject's expression. I look forward to see the progress of this painting.

Sincerely,

Mai :)

Mai,

Thank you for your comments. I realized that the color of the painting as I posted it wasn't very accurate. I took another picture, adjusting my camera's white balance, and this looks more like the actual painting. This is with virtually no changes to the painting. I'm sorry if my earlier posting misled you. Let me know if your various comment still apply.

Close-up

Mai,

In answer to your question, I am painting directly over the underpainting. I want to develop my skills with opaque painting before dealing with glazing.

Even though your repost is better color-wise, you might wish to consider going a tad more neutral with your background.

You might experiment with a thin glaze of a transparent green over your red to neutralize the color a bit.

Personally I feel that the strong direction of the background distracts from the serene expression of the face. I personally would choose a greyish background instead of red, but in some cases it might work.

I would develop your skills in painting in opaque paints; you're on the right track, nice job in the skin-tones! (My suggestion: focus on opaque painting...most old masters didn't glaze to achieve the desired effects, the glazing myth leads mostly to confusion)

Peter

P.S. Was blending the bridge of the nose and the lighted part of the face inspired by Vermeer's 'Girl with the Pearl Earring'?

Karin, Peter,

Thank you for your comments. As Mai has also suggested, I will tone down the background to a more neutral color. As I know nothing about glazing, I find I am not brave enough to try the experiment on an almost-finished painting, so I will paint opaque on top.

Peter, the edge of the nose was almost lost on the reference photo, but I did think of the Vermeer painting when I decided to leave it lost.

Here is the painting with the background redone. I think I will call it finished at this point.

Close-up

Neat!
 

That is such a neat and intuituve interpretation of the photo. This was fun seeing the progression. Thanks Chuck! :)

What is the point of underpainting if you ignore it and paint opaquely on top of it?

Adding a glaze is a piece of cake. Take a little bit of transparent color (i.e., a color you can see through like; sap green, raw sienna, prussian blue, etc.) and add a lot of medium. Paint this mixture over the area that you wish to glaze.

Do not try to glaze with an opaque color (i.e., white, yellow ochre, indian red, etc.) When you "glaze" with an opaque color, it is called a scumble.

If you don't like the way your glaze looks, wipe it off before it dries and try something else.

I also agree with Peter about the stripes - they are too strong.

Here is yet another attempt to suggest a non-specific yet "interesting" background.

As my response to these remarks would have to be lenghty this would move this thread into another direction where it probably starts to get off-topic in this critiques-section. Probably many things regarding this have been discussed before in other threads.

I do not think that easily about glazing. It is one of the most misunderstood aspects of painting-technique. Painting in opaque paint a subtly modelled area, and putting a glaze on top of it often spoils the nuances of the modelling. Once added it is not so easy to remove a certain glaze without damaging the painting in some way. Glazed areas, (or what people do when they think they are glazing) often appear like dark stains on paintings from certain angles, mostly distorting the appearance of the painting.

I don't know where to begin to start to answer this (rethorically meant) question... let's keep it at the conclusion that karin and I differ in opinion.

Searching this forum will provide you lots of information, which will probably be (admittedly) a confusing amount of contradictory remarks by the several different pros on this forum since the misunderstandings, especially about glazing and the use of underpainting are a crucial part of the many differences in interpretation of the painting-techniques of the 16th- and 17th century painters.

Peter