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Ilaria Rosselli Del Turco 06-26-2006 06:45 PM

Disappointment under pressure
 
How do you deal with a portrait that just would not work?

In the recent months I have been working on subjects that I found more challenging, with more complex backgrounds and more ambitious sizes then my previous works.

The results though have been mixed: in the last four works I consider one very good, the second un utter nightmare which I pulled off in the last three days after extensive repainting and weeks of anxiety.

The third one is the most disappointing and the one that has sparked this post, while the last one is on my easel right now and quite promising.

Portrait number three was the one I MOST cared about, a friend of my son, a charming and very bright boy who has sat patiently twice for me without moving a muscle.
My frustration in not achieving a good standard in this work is terrible: I finally decided to give the portrait rather then keep repainting the face.

I told my clients that they should keep it and let it 'season' a little, and that I really needed to have it out of my studio for a while, but it is my intention to take it back and see if I can finally put it right in a few weeks, maybe with a last live sitting. At the same time I don't want to reveal my friend how much I am disppointed.

Was this the right atttitude or should I give up on it and put it behind me? Does any of you have some hidden misfits, perhaps happily hanging on a unknowingly satisfied client's wall ?
Would it have been better instead to honestly start again ?

The culprit :
http://www.ilardt.com/ilardt/childre...s/oliver-1.jpg
( bad pic )

Ilaria

Debra Jones 06-26-2006 07:42 PM

I know exactly what the problem is.
It is from life. Not only that, but it is someone you know!

I am completely sure if you got two or three snapshots from your point of view and worked for 1/2 hour from that reference, you would NAIL it!

The stamina and muscle control of a little dynamo is almost too much to expect to be controlled and that dampening of life energy is what is happening.

Not to get too metaphysical on ya, but I have been tipping my model in the open studio on occasion, especially on the BAD poses and taking a reference shot or two. Literally I often find that that conversion to 2-d from 3-d will let me INSTANTLY see the needed correction.

I hope you do not feel that it is in any way LESS professional to use all the tools at your command. This is a nice little aspirin of a solution to the BIG headache this piece has caused you.

Happy client is the goal.

Harder than having both of you dissatisfied is that picture that you KNOW is just bad, that the client adores. Hard to stop fixing and hard to let go of when you KNOW you have to hold back for the sake of the fee.

Not making enough right now to even pretend such professional vanities, I have happier clients with some of my most mediocre work. The really good stuff is paid for and that is all the thanks I need or get!

Claudemir Bonfim 06-26-2006 07:44 PM

Hello there,

Well, I've started some portraits more than once in the past. Fortunately it is not so common nowadays. I checked that link, that's going to be a very nice work, but if you feel that's not what what you wanted it to be, start it over again and than compare the paintings, you will certainly paint the second one much faster.

Charcoal studies will help you too.

Hope it helps.

Chris Saper 06-26-2006 08:03 PM

If you are disappointed with it, I think you should get it back, regardless of what you ultimately do with it. Otherwise a) it will haunt you forever; b) you won't want to put it in your portfolio; and c) it won't work for you in marketing your portraits.

You could certainly combine a life/photo sitting if you would be so inclined, and take your time with it. I am sure you will get a fresh perspective when you get it back, one way or the other.

Allan Rahbek 06-26-2006 08:21 PM

Ilaria,

try to do something radical about the worst thing in the painting, so maybe it will loosen up.

As I see it you have some nice vertical patterns in the wallpaper, but I think that the chair is too heavy and is sort of overpowering the delicate and light nuances with it's also vertical lines.

I would try to get some diagonal lines into the back of him, a pillow or something, to fill some of the high back space.

Allan

Kimberly Dow 06-26-2006 09:15 PM

Ilaria,

If it were me, I'd restart it. Sometimes one comes along that we just arent happy with and need that fresh start. You WILL get it though -just be patient and tenacious.

Good luck!

Carol Norton 06-26-2006 11:59 PM

Do the right not the expedient thing
 
Ilaria,

That is a real problem unless you decide to put your best out there no matter what. It has taken me ...no IS taking me some real head bashing to decide that, (and mantra repeating that ..."I will never paint from a poor reference again. I will never....." which Chris Saper commanded me to repeat and repeat and...). However, if you send out poor work, it's out there with your name on it. You can never go wrong by doing the highest and best thing.

Take the painting back. Take some good photos, color notes from life, as Deborah suggested and repaint the whole thing. The longer I paint the more I see that no matter how good an artist is, poor paintings can be painted. Bill Whitaker referred to his "burn pile", which I thought was his little joke. Maybe he really does burn paintings that he isn't pleased with. Only he knows. It was hard to think that he didn't come out of the womb painting like he does now. Did we? Is it possible that we all are in a learning mode? What a lot of humility this business requires but without it, no progress can be made. (No, Christopher Isherwood didn't say that...) Your work is beautiful. Keep that standard going.

Marcus Lim 06-27-2006 12:36 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ilaria Rosselli Del Turco
Was this the right atttitude or should I give up on it and put it behind me?

Ilaria,
I guess the main angle i'd like to share on is that of attitudes - not about facing clients but more about the mindset when working with portraits.
Debra pointed something really important here, that you're painting someone you know; a person whom you care for. I had the same experience with working on a portrait of a close friend recently, and more often than once, i was trapped in that naggy emotion i wasn't doing good enough.

I realised later that the additional pressure working on our loved one's portraits, took away much of our logical side of being an artist. This stress, crippled our ability to judge objectively and do our work as if they were our ordinary clients.

I decided i can't work with this "emotional lump" in my head, and i walked away from it for a couple of days. I came back to it, renewed my oath to do it objectively, and finally was able to complete the portrait within the day i got back at it.

So the lesson of the day is: do your portrait like every other portrait done, friend or family. Hope this experience of mine will help you out.

Ilaria Rosselli Del Turco 06-27-2006 05:20 AM

Many thanks to all of you, I especially found, in these posts, the WORDS to explain to my friend that I am not happy with my work and I want to do something about it.
The forum is a harsh and sympathetic jury, which is the best combination to receive good advice.
It is now time for me to lift that phone...
Ilaria

Mary Jane Ansell 06-27-2006 08:06 AM

Hi Ilaria

Good luck and good for you for determining to get the portrait back and re-work it.

I so agree its so important to avoid having a nagging knowledge you have put a "bad" work out there, for your own peace of mind and for the fact that (if it really is) a bad piece then it sits there being bad publicity for you for a very long time!

Actually I wanted to say that a similar thing happened to me with a 4 year old sitter a couple of years ago, he sat (hating to sit still of course) for 3 hours everyweek for 6 weeks, me causing upheaval in the families beautiful home - and at the end of it all I knew I hadn't got a decent painting - all his life had gone, his mannerism and posture had become leaden and stilted and I hated it.

I was so frustrated that it hadn't worked and so torn about how to deal with this "failure" especially as I had taken so much of the families time and patience and they were calling for the piece to be finished already!!

But in the end I came clean (after avoiding the phone a couple of times!!) admitted I wasnt happy and that I knew I could give them the piece as it was but that it wouldn't be the best I could do for them.

I asked for the little boy to come to my studio this time and I tried a completely different pose and lighting set up, I went with my instinct about how I wanted to represent him, this time choosing a more intense focus, darker more dramatic, his pose was much more natural and typical of him and his clothing more personal. That resulting painting went very quickly indeed and the client and I agreed was far, far better as a result.

I hope it works out even better for you this time, I think there was a lot to admire about the first piece you posted here but I might say he is getting somewhat lost in amongst that big white shirt and embossed wall paper.

Very best wishes...
Mary Jane

Cindy Procious 06-27-2006 09:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mary Jane Ansell
I asked for the little boy to come to my studio this time and I tried a completely different pose and lighting set up, I went with my instinct about how I wanted to represent him, this time choosing a more intense focus, darker more dramatic, his pose was much more natural and typical of him and his clothing more personal. That resulting painting went very quickly indeed and the client and I agreed was far, far better as a result.

Mary Jane - is this the one?

http://www.maryjaneansell.co.uk/imag...0701182054.jpg

Mischa Milosevic 06-27-2006 09:11 AM

Ilaria, this is a wonderful painting! As is, it looks grate! You can leave it as is or refine and there is always room for refinement. It all depends on what it is you wish to do with it. Figure out beforehand what it is that you would change and why and then decide whether you wish to make the changes on the painting or start a fresh canvas.

You can Share with your friend how much you would love to do another and how pleasing it is to paint the boy.

Wish you the best.
mischa

Mary Jane Ansell 06-27-2006 09:29 AM

LOL - Hi Cindy - yes that's the one!! ;-)

Alexandra Tyng 06-27-2006 11:00 AM

Ilaria,

I'd like to hear what exactly bothers you about the painting. Is is only the likeness? I think it's a remarkable painting, especially the paint handling and expressiveness in the face. Of course I have no way of seeing the problems with likeness, but it could be a subtle thing as you well know. In my opinion the background could use more spatial depth and less pattern.

I have lots of those "misfits" hanging on satisfied clients' walls. The problem is, I think, that we are our own worst critics. We're painting to solve problems, and we are excruciatingly aware when we have not solved a problem. On a few occasions I've asked the client if I could start over. Only once has a client ever doubted my ability because I took a long time to get the right pose or made a false start. I don't think we should be the least hesitant about telling the client we want to work more on a portrait or start over. We are artists, not machines.

The thing that disturbs me most is when the client can't see the beauty or total transcendence of a certain pose, and insists on another kind of portrait. I'm doing a commission right now with this problem. I'll put my all into it, but I'll always be thinking of what it could have been if the client had given me the artistic freedom to follow my vision.

It's also very frustrating to be in your position, to be given the freedom, and a great subject, and not be able to get the very thing you are aiming for. In your case I would encourage you not to give up. You might be in a period of artistic growth right now. Sometimes these things happen more fequently during those times. I like the idea of taking a photo and trying to pinpoint the likeness problem, and of doing something radical with the part that displeases you. It has so much potential.Good luck with this, Ilaria!

Ilaria Rosselli Del Turco 06-27-2006 02:20 PM

1 Attachment(s)
Thanks for sharing your experience Mary Jane, and Mischa for the encouragement.

I did call my friend today and told her I was not completely satisfied with the painting and that I really wanted a second chance to work with the boy.
She was puzzled as she is very happy with her painting, but still she respects my opinion and has promised me more sittings.
My idea is to paint maybe a slightly smaller work, a more confident one on both parts, I mean less embarassed subject and less anxious painter.

Alexandra, the issue is likeness, yes, but also something with the pose, that oversized shirt, you see the problem is that I don't know either!

I could not avoid thinking of this painting when I started and set the pose, the boys looks so similar... but I later started having doubts: I am no Cezanne!

I made him look a bit clumsy rather then meditative as I initially ment.
Also the light in their house was very dim and too dramatic, perhaps such a strong chiaroscuro is not the best choice for young people.

I am not very keen on reworking the old painting, I lost stamina because of the amount of time I spent on it without knowing exactly what I needed to do. The scraping and sanding has also quite exhausted the surface of the painting!
I am excited with my latest work, which I can't wait to post, and I believe it has restored some of my confidence; I am very motivated to set things straight with this boy now!
Ilaria

Michele Rushworth 06-28-2006 11:21 AM

Quote:

I told my clients that they should keep it and let it 'season' a little, and that I really needed to have it out of my studio for a while, but it is my intention to take it back and see if I can finally put it right in a few weeks, maybe with a last live sitting. At the same time I don't want to reveal my friend how much I am disppointed.
It's a very nice portrait, though the boy's expression seems a bit vacant. I think I would have set it aside in my studio facing the wall for a few weeks and then worked on it again before showing it to the client.

The very successful portrait artist Bart Lindstrom recently said in a lecture to a room full of other artists, "Every 10th portrait is a disaster".

Ilaria Rosselli Del Turco 06-28-2006 12:12 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Michele Rushworth
The very successful portrait artist Bart Lindstrom recently said in a lecture to a room full of other artists, "Every 10th portrait is a disaster".

I must remember this one!

Marina Dieul 06-28-2006 01:02 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ilaria Rosselli Del Turco


I am excited with my latest work, which I can't wait to post, and I believe it has restored some of my confidence; I am very motivated to set things straight with this boy now!
Ilaria

Great Ilaria!
Gauguin and Picasso ( blue period) came to my mind immediately when I saw this one. I like it a lot!

Richard Bingham 06-28-2006 01:16 PM

That is worth remembering. (and sobering!)

However, the "commercial" aspect of a portrait commission makes that cold comfort for the client. Two aspects of this problem are worth careful consideration. One is the amount of "experimentation" involved in producing the work. A rule of commercial music is to reserve "pushing the envelope" for rehearsal time, and drop back to "tried, true, and well-polished" when on-stage. The caution would apply to portrait commissions, I think. The other is that while no one should ever turn out a piece they cannot "stand behind", it's more important how the client receives it than whether it's entirely pleasing to the painter.

That said, and given the homage to Cezanne, I like it!

Cindy Procious 06-29-2006 10:39 AM

Ilaria, I'm wading in late, so I'm sure you're well underway with your next painting of your friend.

I wonder, though, if part of the issue with the first one is the proportions? Doesn't his head seem too small for his body?

Other than that - to me - it is a lovely painting - and very much your signature style. :thumbsup:

Ilaria Rosselli Del Turco 06-30-2006 05:28 AM

Thanks Cindy, that might be it !
Marina, Richard, I appreciate your input
thanks
Ilaria

Mari DeRuntz 06-30-2006 10:03 PM

Quote:

Would it have been better instead to honestly start again ?
Always trust this voice - it is your intuition and is usually telling you what you already know.

Have a lovely trip to Italy. While you're spoiled rotten in London with centuries of design and art everywhere you turn, and the British Museum's recent Michelangelo show, the invenzione of the Italians remains a benchmark, up through Annigoni, anyway.

I hope western culture has not completely overrun her charm.

Buon lavoro....

Linda Brandon 06-30-2006 10:50 PM

Ilaria, I know you're trying to paint children from life and I just wanted to say that I think there should be a special Artist's Medal of Valor for this. I think the problem that you are having - that we all are having - is that clients generally expect tight photographic fidelity, something hard enough to achieve with an adult client, much less a fidgety child. He is not a still life and not an artist's model. I personally haven't been happy with the stupified expression that a child gets when he watches TV during a sitting, though I know artists that do this and a few are successful.

I think your loose, charming, painterly approach is the stylistic solution.

I think there is a way to combine life sittings for head only (full face or profile I think would be easier than 3/4 view) and clothing on dummies and stretch out the live sittings over a few days, working only on the head during the live sittings. I'm still working on this myself but your brain will be the first one I pick apart with respect to working methods.


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