Painting Techniques - Questions

John Reidy · 03-11-2006, 02:36 PM

I am curious and would like to compare my work flow compared to others. I"m not sure if this is the proper place for this discussion and if innappropriate, please let me know. But here goes.

I was trained to spend more time back from my easel than on it. The theory being that my analysis of subject to painting was critical to learn. Over time I can make faster judgements especially when starting a painting. As my painting draws close to the end I am spending a lot of time away from the canvas. Sometimes I can take a week or two to finalize the painting. In other words I try to become very critical in order to achieve my best effort.

I have read several threads where an artist had posted that they had painted all night to try to finish a portrait to meet a deadline.

I'm wondering what the pattern is among the artists here, do most of you take a while to finalize a painting or can you judge and paint so well that you can reach your goals in a relatively smooth process?

Thanks to any and all for responding.

Michele Rushworth · 03-11-2006, 04:28 PM

My process is like yours in that things slow way down at the end, and I take a lot more time to look and think, and think and look -- and then maybe change one or two things. Then I'll think and look some more until I can't see anything that I want to change.

The painting may look finished to others. (My husband will say, "It looks done, when can you deliver it?") and is amazed when I tell him it will probably be a couple more weeks. Most of that intervening time is spent doing something else so I can take a break from a particular piece, then I'll make a few changes and wait some more -- or else it's drying time.

By comparison, my process goes pretty fast in the beginning (after the planning is done, that is).

Mischa Milosevic · 03-11-2006, 05:32 PM

John, this is a excellent point and something that all at times need to reflect on. I think all can get tied up in something, we are working on, that we at times cannot see what is starring us in the face.

I, like you, do the walk, back and forth, back and forth. Being that my studio space is quite small I need to walk out into the day room in order to see my work at a proper distance. Again all relative how big the peace I'm working on is.

When I get close to completion or I am stuck on something that I am not able to figure out at the time, I take it of the easel and hang it on the wall and work on something else. While it is on the wall I attempt to solve the problem critically asking question after question like: what do I need to do to make it work, to give the subject life.

I must admit at time I have been inspired and was able to finish something quite quickly but have submitted it to extensive critique before presenting the finished product to the client. I also admit that I have spent sleepless nights but I do my best to stay away from such procedures. Most of the time I reserve the night hours for sleep or at times study, always keeping in mind the wisdom in proper rest.

John Reidy · 03-11-2006, 07:03 PM

Dear Michele and Mischa,

Thanks so much for responding. I'm lost right now in a difficult portrait. Difficult primarily because I accepted this job with very poor reference material. It is a family of four, two of whom are deceased. The mother had 100's of polaroids, 4 x 5's, color and black and white. She also wanted it to be from a period of about 20 - 25 years ago, when all were alive and well (she lost her daughter over 2o years ago when she was just 12).

I've composed the piece through several photographs of roughly the same time period. I've done a drawing and a color study and both have been approved. The painting has proved to be very challenging due to some areas that are not clearly discernable.

Consequently I'm at that point where I am looking alot and working very little but making headway which prompted me to reflect on my process and how it compares to others (especially those of you who are successfully making a living from it).

I am thankful that you have shared this with me as it helps me in this difficult moment to reestablish my sense of being.

When I finish I'd like to post it in the unveiling along with the process I went through.

And, oh yes, I need to add that I explained to the client that the painting may be more "painterly" than others. I feel confident she understands. Without that understanding I couldn't have accepted the opportunity.

Mischa Milosevic · 03-11-2006, 07:52 PM

John, I truly sipathise and understand your concerne. It is not a simple task that you are attempting. Still, stay confident that you will resolve all isues pertaining to this project. You will do fine.

I hope this helps. When I am stuck and in similar situation I sit down and rehash all the steps in oil painting. First composition of form. composition of value and color in simple masses. Do they harmonize or not. Down the line after correctly establishing shadow and light shapes, halftones. I ask if my subject over-all represent 3D form. Than I go to the smaller forms and ask the same question.I think you will do much better if you ask these questions than copy your reference to a T. The likeness will come if you have all the shapes in and the color is what you feel and understand that works.

Sincere wishes,
mischa

John Reidy · 03-11-2006, 10:57 PM

Thank you Mischa

I am definitely at that point, "is it in harmony?". That is usually where my fine tuning comes in to play. This particular project gave me good reference for the larger shapes but not so much color nor details. This is due to various pictures with similar lighting to say the least (mostly family type snapshots with an attached flash, ugh!) and fuzziness of the original photographs. This challenge is like creating something from what is suggested.

Thank you for your input on how you approach these issues. I find it always to be most helpful to be reminded of these elements.

But for fear that this develops into a thread on problem solving I would still ask for anybody to sign in and share their work flow process.

Richard Budig · 08-22-2006, 07:32 AM

John:

Just read you post, and know your feeling. I, too, have struggled with resource material that ran from so-so to terrible. Fortunately (so far, at least) it hasn't mattered that much because I was doing some "odd ball stuff" for my wife. She has several brothers who fought (some died) in WWII, and asked if I would paint vignettes from old photos, one of two of which were black and white.

Yikes!!! For no reason I can pinpoint, some went well, some went so-so, and one or two were just as awful as the old photos.

As for getting down to the finish of a piece . . . my progress seems much like everyone elses -- fast at first, and then slows as finish approaches.

I'm sure this has to do with the fact that first few days, I'm just laying in big shapes, colors and values. It is when I start adjusting within shapes, colors and values that it begins to get complicated.

Also, the longer I do this, the more I amaze myself to find that I can usually work another week (maybe more) after I think the painting is finished. I'll put down my brush, sigh, and say fini. But, the next day, I decide to work just another hour, and find I've put in another day on the thing, with the same thing happening the following few days. I begin to wonder if a painting is ever really finished.

I recently watch a video by a guy named Jay Moore (www.jaymoore.com, I believe) in which he points out how the eye sees, which, as you probably know, it sees less and less as our peripheral vision drifts farther from our point of interest. He also makes the point that if you look at portraits by the old greats -- Rembrandt, et al -- you'll see that this is how they looked at and painted their subjects . . . with the outer areas going softer and grayer. It's a point to remember when you feel you've "lost it" over in one of the far corners of your paiting.

John Reidy · 08-22-2006, 11:45 AM

Thanks, Richard,

I have been busy and haven't visited the site for a long while. Your answer prompted me to respond.

I finished the portrait I wrote about and had an unveiling. I am happy to report that everyone was well pleased.

As promised, I will post the painting in the Unveiling Section along with the process if you are interested.

Ant Carlos · 08-24-2006, 10:56 PM

I would add that if there's someone around eager to take your work away from you, you'll paint faster and the painting will most often end better. We artists tend to think too much before holding a brush and start a session. Just let go, and it will turn out well. Works for me at least.

Best,

Ant

John Reidy · 08-25-2006, 07:34 AM

Thanks, Ant,

That is a refreshing point of view and I believe on target. In my career as a production artist and a manager of other graphic artists I often found that the production schedule rarely effected the quality. The longer the schedule allowed the longer it took to complete.

I haven't had the occasion yet for a rush portrait but I am glad you posted your experience. If I ever face that predicament I will remember this in my decision to accept or decline.