Membership fees for Forum access

[Cynthia Daniel]

I would not pay a fee, I think, but I would probably be willing to donate 20 or 25 dollars a year. It's something emotional.

Comes out to the same dollars.

When people are going to pay they will DEMAND a critique (because they pay for it) and expect those from the volunteers who give those.

Very often they do that now.

Actually, we could use more pros giving critiques. Marvin? Why don't you critique? That would be very helpful.

[Cynthia Daniel]

Stacy,

And where else would I have found out ahead of time that I can be looking forward to a Morgan Weistling video??

I know! Morgan, you have to let us know when it comes out.

[Jeff Fuchs]

I've been browsing the responses, and seen much mention of selling ads. While this may offend some, it's a business decision, plain and simple.

You might want to look into Google AdWords. All you have to do is sign up and add their code to your site. They sell the ads, you don't. What I like about it is that you don't get commissions on sales. You get paid for clicks. I have found that commissions from affiliate programs seem to be non-existent. With AdWords, SOG visitors don't have to spend a nickel for you to make a commission. They just have to click the ad.

I've read their terms of service, and I saw that you have to be very careful not to encourage people to click the ads. All clicks have to be completely unsolicited. But the ads are topic-specific, so they will appeal to artists.

Give them a look. www.adwords.google.com/

[Minh Thong]

Reading Peter's post re-enforced a notion already brewing as I read thru the posts.

I rarely post here, because the level of activity is much lower than other forums and there isn't a lot of new info week to week, and because I'm not drawing or painting at a level which is going to elicit a constructive critique beyond "You need to learn how to draw.". In my humble opinion, these two things are both related to the targeted audience at SOG ... fulltime professional portrait artists. There isn't as much activity here because most of you guys are probably earning your living in front of an easel or a classroom, and you just don't have time to contribute as much as you might like. And since the site is geared toward working pros, nothing I post for critique is likely to receive notice, and even less likely to elicit suggestions from a professional artist. Maybe we're back to the 'time factor' with this one. If a professional artist is going to take time away from earning a living he or she probably isn't going to waste it by commenting on my student-level crap. Believe me ... I understand on both counts. I knew that coming in two years ago.

All this said, however, I have received a lot of excellent advice on things such as cast drawing, sight size, color theory, etc. I have gotten info here that I probably couldn't get from other forums as readily. Steven, Marvin, Tom and others have been VERY gracious in answering my beginner questions, as time allows them to. Being self-taught, and not having access to a classical portraitist in my area, I consider this forum an invaluable resource.

So, my vote would be to have two functional areas within the site. One area free for those whose work is not yet at a level which will elicit feedback from a working pro (though we have had a couple 'peer critiques' which were excellent ... thanks Jeff ). Sort of an area for the student-level hacks among us who aspire to amateur glory to ask questions about techniques, materials, etc. And then another area for the working professionals to compare ideas, offer critiques, etc. among their peers who do this for a living and who don't usually have the time to participate further.

I want to say again, so it's not taken the wrong way: I definitely understand that some of you paint to put food on the table and don't have the time to baby-sit us beginners. I am sincerely grateful for the info that some have given so graciously.

Does any of this make sense? A free area for students of portraiture, and a pay area for those who need/want critiques or have more advanced needs?

Phil Minh Thong Holbrook
(Teacherless Amateur Hack Aspiring to Greater Things)

[SB Wang]

For valuable information-- no paying, no gain.

[Cynthia Daniel]

You might want to look into Google AdWords. All you have to do is sign up and add their code to your site. They sell the ads, you don't. What I like about it is that you don't get commissions on sales. You get paid for clicks.

I'll have to look. I'm aware of their program where you pay Google based on ad words (keywords) and that puts you in the right highlighted area of returned resulst. Are you sure this isn't what they are talking about?

I have found that commissions from affiliate programs seem to be non-existent. With AdWords, SOG visitors don't have to spend a nickel for you to make a commission. They just have to click the ad.

A few tasteful and relevant ads are not obnoxious. You have to get a lot of traffic to make an affiliate program worthwhile. I get about $800 a year from my bookstore. Seems some Forum members don't know I have one. I should put an ad on the Forum for my bookstore.

But, guess what? Google is an Amazon affiliate. So, if you use Google to search for a book title and then buy it from Amazon, they get a commission. They have to be makding a bloody killing on that...very clever.[/QUOTE]

[Jane Bradley]

I don't see what everyone is making such a big deal about. Even if we agreed to 40 bucks a year that is only about three dollars a month, which is not even a dollar a week- I haven't posted a lot, but I have read on and off and the information has been useful. Even more importantly, since I am kind of isolated from other artists - as are many of us who spend our days painting alone - there is some bit of inspiration derived from seeing art from some of the people on this forum and hearing them express their ideas, that I really can't get anywhere else right now.

In the end we all need to make the assessment of the value of this to us - As for me, I will just buy one less pack of gum (used to be cigarettes) a week.

[Cynthia Daniel]

In case anyone has any doubt of the amount of traffic from non-members, there have been over 1000 views of this thread as of this writing. I think it was around 270 sometime last night. This may yet be the most read thread ever!

[Jeff Fuchs]

I'm aware of their program where you pay Google based on ad words (keywords) and that puts you in the right highlighted area of returned resulst. Are you sure this isn't what they are talking about?

That's the other side of the same coin. The ads they sell are placed on hundreds of websites, and the website owners make the commission.

Here's the direct link to the program:

https://www.google.com/adsense/?hl=en_US

[Cynthia Daniel]

Jeff,

I'll check it out, but it would have to be very targeted and unobnoxious advertising.

Also, if you haven't checked out the other posts, there are other reasons to charge a fee.