Paint Now . . . Stretch Later?

[Richard Budig]

What are the pros and cons of painting on canvas, and then stretching it later, a la Richard Schmid?

Sometimes, I tape a piece of canvas to a hard board, paint something, and put it aside to decide later what I'm going to do with it . . . stretch or mount.

Anyone have any, or a lot of experience with this?

[Richard Bingham]

So long as you use a dead-flat, stable, pre-primed canvas off the roll that neither buckles nor presents other surface problems when taped to a back-board, I can only see advantages . . . it's quick, it's easy, and gives you a lot of flexibility to choose the sizes of your projects and perhaps crop them later.

The downside is that stretching the piece over bars is more difficult once finished, and may stress the applied paint. Bending edges over the bars may upset some paint, and the work piece would have to be a minimum of 3-6" "oversize" in each direction initially when taped to the board.

Better to mount such finished pieces to panels - for example, Gatorboard, alumalite or dibond . . .

[Lesley Grindlay]

Would anyone know what to use to glue the finished pieces to panels? I was thinking of using gamblin ground to prime the back of the piece and then glue it to the primed panel with say, rabbit skin glue???

[Richard Bingham]

There are a number of heat-sensitive dry-mount methods in use by conservators for this purpose. The current order of the day is to use methods which are reversible with minimum stress on the artworks.

Kremer Pigments markets a water-based vinyl-acrylic adhesive (Beva-Gel) intended to replace traditional "maroflage" materials and it works quite well. Its cost is also higher than a cat's back, and the stuff is not materially dissimilar from adhesives commonly available in any paint store for installing heavier commercial type wall coverings which are chemically similar. I've used these with good effect, and see little difference between them and Beva-Gel.

One supposes the piece being mounted was adequately sized and primed before it was painted on, so priming the backside prior to mounting on a panel is superfluous. For the record, rabbit skin glue is not compatible with acrylic polymer coatings, and may or may not adhere dependably. RSG definitely does not bond to synthetic laminates like alumalite or dibond panels.

RSG is perfect for adhering raw canvas to bare wood or composite materials such as MDF, however.

[Thomasin Dewhurst]

Richard - you are invaluable! I didn't think it was possible to do this in an archival way (at least, I didn't think I was capable of doing it in an archival way). It also cheapens the shipping of paintings to galleries because often the galleries have the means to re-stretch or bond them to board once they arrive, and I have often started doing just a head and really felt it needed the whole body added to it, but on a 16" x 20" canvas it wouldn't quite fit!

One question leading on from this - what is the safest way to roll a canvas ( the idea came from the way stolen paintings are taken out of museums - according to Hollywood, of course; I haven't had the honour of knowing an a art thief - and rolled. It would certainly open up many countries I wouldn't even think of approaching galleries in because of the shipping expense, but rolling canvases would lessen the cost greatly.

[Thomasin Dewhurst]

Originally Posted by Thomasin Dewhurst

Richard - you are invaluable!

When I say "Richard", I mean "Richards". Thanks Richard Budig for asking the question and thank-you especially, Richard Bingham for answering it in your usual brilliant way.

[Richard Bingham]

Aw, shucks, Thomasin! It's my pleasure to offer my experience to this forum, I hope it's helpful now and then. Over the years, I've been very fortunate to have made my living working with a very wide variety of materials and methods in painting and art-related fields.

None less than Rubens himself rolled paintings for transport! The best (only?) way is to roll the painting with the painted side outward, preferably over a rigid core, such as a card-board tube with a minimum diameter of 3". (the larger, the better!)

This way, any fine cracks that result from the stress of being bent into a roll will close up when the piece is flattened. Rolled the other way, (paint-side inside) unrolling the canvas may actually pop bits of paint off, if it's quite thoroughly dry and has become at all brittle. Of course, the older the painting, the greater the risk, since ultimately, all oil paint films will become brittle as glass (that takes over 100 years in most cases).

[Lesley Grindlay]

Thank you Richard, I appreciate ur advice, this is certainly a weight off my mind. Although painting now, dealing with it later is convenient and quick, storage is a pain when they're wet. however I found a solution to that, i strung a wire cord from one end to another end of my studio and hang my wet canvases with clips. Still all the loose canvases are a pain, i'm going to opt for painting directly on primed panels or glueing canvas to panels.

[David Clemons]

Originally Posted by Richard Bingham

...RSG is perfect for adhering raw canvas to bare wood or composite materials such as MDF, however.

Personally, I wouldn't describe it as "perfect." Many times I get an uneven bond with patches that don't stick and pucker. This is with canvas sized with RSG glued to raw wood. I've had similar problems with PVA type glues. They're strong, but unreliable for me. I would also recommend the Beva Gel or solution, however. There's a less expensive similar product called Rhoplex that has worked well. One of the most consistently successful glues for me has been wheat paste/dextrine.

[David Clemons]

Originally Posted by Thomasin Dewhurst

...what is the safest way to roll a canvas ...

There's a good PDF article here from Golden Paints about canvas transportation and packaging, including advice on rolling a canvas. It deals mostly with acrylics, but it still applies.
http://www.goldenpaints.com/justpaint/jp11.pdf